Right Click and Edit - slow and pinwheel
Answered
Hello, I'm struggling with slow response when opening a file in Edit or Right Click. In both scenarios I get the pin wheel for about 4-5 seconds then the file will begin to load. With Right Click it takes about 10 seconds and with Edit it takes about 5 seconds of pin wheeling before the file begins loading Edit (note this doesn't include load time).
So far, I've reset deleted settings which didn't work so I reinstalled ON1, and rebuilt the my Catalogs. I've allowed three weeks to be sure my catalogs have had time to rebuilt. At this point the PerfectBrowse Cache has not increased in size so I assume it's done. I've also turned off Keyword AI. The pinwheeling time remains the same not matter weather the file is RAW or JPG.
System Info:
- MacBook Pro 2021 with M1 Pro chip
- Ram 16 GB
- ON1 2023
- PerfectBrowse resides on MacBook SSD
- Catalogs on M1 SSD and external SATA SSD connected with Thunderbolt 4
- No antivirus on the computer
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What other programs do you have running while this is happening? Open Activity Monitor and click on its CPU tab then click on the CPU% column title to sort everything by its CPU usage. You should see something like this (ignore the very high einstein entries, that's a background program I run that processes astronomical data. It's always at the top of the list. ;) )
What is using all your CPU?
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Brian, always great to hear from you! Attached is a screen shot. As you see there is plenty of head room on my CPU. Does anything stand out?
Currently open: Calendar, Apple Mail, Outlook, Word, Excel, Calculator, Notes, System Settings, Contacts, and Activity Monitor
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I would Quit everything you are not using. Even thought there is CPU headroom, the program could me making room in memory by swapping out the programs you aren't actively using to make room and that makes the hard drive busy which would prevent PR from opening the image file right away.
The only program's I keep open are Mail and Safari.
You can monitor the Memory and Disk usage panels to see if anything is hogging those resources but I would try quitting everything you don't need while editing.
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Wow, ON1 is intensive on memory. Yes, shutting down everything did improve response times.
I did a quick experiment below:
- No other program open - 3 second delay
- Mail and Safari (one tab) open - 5 second delay
- Safari plus 5 tabs open - 9-12 second delay and pinwheeling (delay longer when TimeMachine is running.
Thank you for your help, I know you're not working for ON1 but this is an area of concern. I have a "new" M1 Pro Mac with upgraded processor and it is struggling to keep up with basic photo organizing.
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I run a 1st gen M1 mini w/ 16GB RAM and 1TB SSD. I've moved my PerfectBrowseCache and Scratch space to an external Thunderbolt 4 SSD. My photos are on an external SSD connected through a Thunderbolt 4 dock to one of its USB ports.
How are you defining delay? Is it the time it takes for the image to appear on screen or is it the time it takes before you can actually start editing it?
My photos show up on screen almost immediately but there is a few seconds delay as the program creates all the AI generated masks from the RAW data before it becomes available for editing. The larger the RAW file I'm working with (5 digital cameras over the years has seen them grow from 5MB to more than 50MB). This is unavoidable and is to be expected.
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Web browsers do consume a lot of RAM for some reason. While I keep Safari open I normally do not have any open windows in it to minimize its needs. Firefox is even worse, especially when I've been on Facebook's site. That really chews up the RAM.
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It’s a bug. See earlier thread https://on1help.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/community/posts/13078006805133
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Brian and David, thank you for responses. Brian, to answer your question:
What is the Delay
- Grid Mode - I will click on a photo, then approximately 10 seconds later the Right Click Menu will be present. Sometimes, I see the pinwheel
- Edi Mode - After clicking on the photos there were will be 8 seconds of pinwheel then the photo will start loading (loading bar will show at the bottom of the screen). Photo is
What's open:
- Only this browser page in Safari
- Apple Mail
- Activity Monitor
Thank you for the information about moving the PerfectBrowser, I've seen that you've posted about this in the past. I'm using a OWC external 4 bay drive unit with two open bays. It is connected using 10gbps connection. Would a SSD SATA be fast enough?
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An SSD SATA should be fast enough but you do not want to put it into that bay. That means it is sharing that single I/O connection between the bay and the computer with up to 3 other drives. You want to connect your scratch drive directly to the computer so it has its own private I/O connection to the system. I just got an email post this morning about how even with a Thunderbolt 4 hub I/O speeds can drop as low as 400MB out of a potential 10GB/s bandwidth. It appears that the macOS will give priority to the fastest drive which consumes most of the bandwidth leaving little for other drives. If you're interested in details see https://eclecticlight.co/2023/03/20/how-connecting-your-ssd-to-a-thunderbolt-hub-can-slow-it-to-a-crawl/#respond
I/O problems can be notoriously difficult to troubleshoot. Someone posted yesterday (I think) that they found an I/O cable that was causing PR to be slow. Replacing it solved the problem.
My previous system, a MacBook Pro, would spontaneously and randomly disconnect my Scratch drive the first time Photo RAW was launched for the day. It didn't always happen but when it did it was always on the 1st launch. I could quit the program and relaunch it all day long after that without any more problems. I swapped the SSD, the external enclosure it was in, and the I/O cable one by one and I could never get rid of the problem. Tech support and the engineers couldn't duplicate the problem. When the laptop died and I replaced it with this mini the problem went away.
At present I'm at a loss for why your system is responding so slowly. There must be something going on in the background causing the delays. You should contact tech support. Be sure to give them the System Report asked for in How to submit a problem to ON1 Tech Support - A Step-by-step Guide. I would also include the link to this thread so they can be brought up to speed on what we've already gone through.
One more thing, in reference to David's post about the bug, how many items do you have in the Send To… section of the File menu? Having too many entries there seems to cause a slow down.
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Brian, thanks for the details, I will send it to Tech Support and will keep this tread posted on any developments. Very interesting article about Thunderbolt 3/4 and how speed can be downgraded. As always, I appreciate your great feedback and I hope I can get an answer (which doesn't cost to much to fix).
On the Send To section of File menu, I have not added any items. The only items are Adobe Lightroom, QuickTime and Other Applications.
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I'll be interested to hear what support has to say.
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Brian, I apologizing for not getting back to this thread but life got very busy. After numerous correspondences with ON1 Tech we were able to resolve the issues. Below is a summary of my discussions plus copied directions from the tech desk that finally fixed my issues. I was given a link from the help desk to download the most recent version.
- The first recommended for me to unplug all connected devices which included a BenQ 4k monitor, Dell 2K monitor, and a OWC 4 hub external hard drive running a SSD and TimeMachine drive. However, none of the actions improved the performance. I was seeing constant pinwheeling when clicking on Edit or Right Click with delays between 7 to 13 seconds.
- The next response was to un-cataloging a few of my larger catalogs which was also unsuccessful
- Finally, it was a complete reinstall that fixed everything. They also recommended setting the previews to Medium.
Below is from ON1 Support
If this still does not help then we would recommend doing a complete clean install of ON1 Photo RAW 2023 by following the steps below.
If you have installed any presets or extras you can back up these folders in the following locations.
Go to the User level Library:- Note, that the User Library is hidden by default. To reach it, open a new Finder window, then press and hold the Option key on your keyboard while you click the Go menu at the top of your screen. Select the Library option which appears. From there, you can continue into the Application Support/ON1.
~/Library/Application Support/ON1: Extras 2023
~/Library/Application Support/ON1/ ON1 PHOTO RAW 2023: Presets
After backing up any content please proceed with a manual deletion of ON1 PHOTO RAW 2023 folders and files.
Go to the System level Library:
`MacHD>Library>Application Support: ON1: Delete all 2023 folders
And the User level Library
~/Library/Application Support/ON1/ Delete all 2023 folders
Also in the User Library
~/Library/Preferences (delete all instances of com.ononesoftware2023.plist pref files)0 -
Good to hear you got it sorted out.
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