Skip to main content

45mp cameras - RAW image size performance in ON1

Comments

17 comments

  • Brian Lawson Community moderator

    I have worked with files as large as 2GB. Yes, the program can slow down but there are things you can do to mitigate that. I was working on a file last night with 6 Local Adjustment layers and 8 Effects. When I had to go back to the bottom of the Effects stack to modify a mask things got a bit slow. I lowered the  Preferences > System > Strength slider so less time was spent rendering and more time spent tracking brush movement. I also turned off Dynamic Contrast in the Effects panel to speed things up.

    I don't have time to find it right now but I've written recently on this same subject that explained the Editing Pipeline (it's in the User Guide) and how things like I mentioned above come into play. You should be able to find it with a little searching.

    1
  • Brian Lawson Community moderator

    I have tried c-RAW as I have explained more than once. I'm glad you find the results acceptable. I prefer to stick with uncompressed photos.

    1
  • Brian Lawson Community moderator

    I shoot a Canon R5 mirrorless which produces 52MP raw files and I do not have any problems with the file size. I am running a Mac mini M1 though 16GB of RAM. A newer video card and more RAM certainly wouldn't hurt your system but I'll let a Windows expert talk about that.

    0
  • Glen Dixon

    Thanks Brian for the quick comment. Do you often do multi layer composites where the *.onphoto file size grows substantially and still find ON1 comfortably responsive? The one I was testing with grew to 273mb before I ended that testing.

    0
  • Vladislav Jurco

    80 MPix RAW Panasonic RAW, 4 layers stacked above each other with different modes (Screen, Multiply etc). On each of them some AI mask, some AI mask refinements, some completely brushed manual masking - it still works - not completely fluidly - but usable.

    My setup is similar to yours 8700k/5GB, 64 GB DDR4, NVIDIA 1080TI 11GB VRAM - OC to 2000 MHZ max. 2xNVME SSD 2TB each PCIEx3

    Generally HiRes files are not a big problem but more layers (I mean real layers not local adjustments) might be dangerous (output size). As a graphic designer in the past I was used to create PSD file with sometimes 30-40 layers and switching to different layer comps with a blink of an eye - within one file. When I switched to ON1 I found it better to limit the layers to some reasonable number and whenever possible use local adjustments + plus speed-up the work switching off temporarily some adjustments which are not necessary to see with live rendering right now.

    Would say I8700 is fine, but RAM is important (ON1 is RAM hungry). With catalogue roughly 40 000 pics and opened such a file, everything put together and 32GB RAM is gone just by ON1. And GPU is important in AI based operations&more fluid movements of e.g. brush when making selections or movements of cursor/panning. Right now thinking of RTX4070 (TI) just because TDP is lower (200W) compared to 1080TI (250W) and I should not need another power supply. And it is 12GB . Working with above described file, VRAM consumption was roughly 70% (out of 11GB). Just switching to another application within your workflow (say TOPAZ) and you are asking for a problem.

    Just my 0,02$

    0
  • Glen Dixon

    Brian, I've dug through and found some of the various workflow tips for enhancing performance and will be reviewing in depth.

    Vladislav, thanks for the comments on your similar hardware workflow tips. I seem to be maintaing ample system RAM reserve but pushing my 1660 Super pretty hard. Nvidia has a couple of 40xx series cards coming out with supposedly very competitive pricing coming out. That may push some of the lower class card pricing down as well. That's where I'm going to hit next. As an aside it sure seems that ON1 should review their published minimum specs for PhotoRaw to bring them more in line with the real world....but I digress, thanks to you both for your thoughts.

    0
  • Jose Omar Santiago Colon

    I have a Canon R5 but I use the CRAW images (compressed ones)and Iam facing same performance issues as many of us having a top computer (currently Ryzen 5900X, RTX 3070 8G, 64GB DDR360).

    I recommend you to have at least 32GB of RAM and more VRAM, those are the fastest memories at your computer so more space can help software to accommodate photo data with ease and share them to CPU/GPU at speed light.

    Iam now build a Ryxen 7900X, Radeon 7900XT 20GB, 64GB DDR5 5600 so I can expect better performance due incresed VRAM (from 8GB to 20GB) and faster IPC of the 7900X. I will let you know. 

    0
  • Brian Lawson Community moderator

    You are aware that cRAW files are not supported with Photo RAW's Tier 1 (homebuilt) raw processor. It uses the open source LibRAW Tier 2 engine which may not provide as good results. I've done some testing, taking the same photo both compressed and uncompressed and I can barely tell the difference but it is there.

    "Note: we do not support Canon Compressed RAW formats  sRAW or mRAW with our Tier 1 ONRaw engine. Though these files will open using our Tier 2 engine (LibRAW), Camera Profiles will not be available."

    Supported File Types and Camera Models for ON1 Photo RAW 2023.5

    0
  • Keith Reeder

    "You are aware that cRAW files are not supported with Photo RAW's Tier 1 (homebuilt) raw processor."

    I shoot C-RAW (R5 and R7) and the results from Photo RAW are stellar (except that it truly stinks at exporting "downsized" images, if you have any interest in sharpness and detail) so LibRAW seems to be doing a fine job.

    But I suspect that you're confusing C-RAW (which is a proper undemosaiced file, albeit compressed) with the older sRAW and mRAW formats (which are already demosaiced) - camera profiles are definitely available for R5 and R7 C-RAW files (it's the only format I use):

     

    0
  • Brian Lawson Community moderator

    No, I am talking about Canon’s compressed raw format. I shoot an R5.

    0
  • Keith Reeder

    Give C-RAW a go, Brian - I think you'll conclude that it's "Tier 1" supported, and ON1's own guidance has nothing to say about C-RAW:

    "Note: we do not support Canon Compressed RAW formats  sRAW or mRAW with our Tier 1 ONRaw engine. Though these files will open using our Tier 2 engine (LibRAW), Camera Profiles will not be available."

    (C-RAW is completely different to sRAW and mRAW - all "Canon compressed RAW formats" are not created equal.)

    I get exactly the same list of camera profiles for my R5 and R7 as I do for my (full-size, uncompressed) 1D-X and 7D Mk II files. I can't see how that would be the case unless C-RAW is fully supported.

    0
  • Brian Lawson Community moderator

    Different strokes for different folks. I don't want to argue about this. I can see a difference and I have my preferences while you have yours.

    0
  • Brian Lawson Community moderator

    If you seek more clarity, the place to ask is tech support. That's who I would have to go through to ask or make the suggestion.

    0
  • Keith Reeder

    Funny you should mention that...

    This, from tech support tonight (confirmed by the "VP of Development", no less):

     
    "Stevie (ON1)
    Jun 26, 2023, 11:49 PDT

    Hello,

    Our VP of Development has further clarified that yes cRAW is Tier 1.

    The newer cRAW compressed format for CR3 files uses our ONRAW Tier 1 Library and is fully Tier 1 supported."

    So if you're seeing a difference between processed R5 CR3s and C-RAWs, it ain't down to the processing engine Photo RAW is using for them.

    0
  • Brian Lawson Community moderator

    That's good to know, and yes, it isn't the processing engine it is the compressed file itself. When you throw away data the quality of that data inevitably decreases.

    Thanks for passing that along.

    0
  • Keith Reeder

    "I have tried c-RAW as I have explained more than once"

    While being under the impression that you're going to get inferior results, which is not the case: I'm talking about you revisiting the format from the point of view of satisfying yourself that ON1's guidance on this is out of date. 

    Again, we wouldn't see a full set of camera profiles if Photo RAW was pushing C-RAWs into a less effective processing pipeline.

    So you're gaining nothing - but it's your camera.

    -1
  • Keith Reeder

    At the very least, Brian - I imagine that you've got an "in" to the company denied to the rest of us, so get them to revisit the page and update it, as I'm certain that it's simply wrong as it stands to suggest that all compressed CR3s are subject to this rule.

    -1

Please sign in to leave a comment.