Update on slowness and latency in ON1 RAW and my MAC
I spent the morning working with Apple tech to walk through my system to see why I’m only experiencing latency with ON1 and no other program. I was with a Level 2 tech, whatever that means, but she seemed very knowledgeable about the Apple OS and how it interacts with apps and programs. There was severe latency with the ON1 loading and writing to disk. Which I knew but my goal was to find the issue. I like ON1 and their product but it came to be totally unusable even as a stand-alone program.
What led me to work with Apple, and dig deeper, I loaded ON1 RAW on my HP Powerbook with a SSD and ON1 Raw ran great, so I wanted Apple to help me determine if it was the OS (I'm on Mojave) or the program.
I decided to do a deep reinstall and used ON1's MAC remover tool. Seems I also had remnants of 2018 on my drive as well. So after removing and doing a new install, the program has vastly improved its performance. I have not yet loaded up all the saved presets I had but will do one at a time to see if there is any effect on the performance.
Just wanted to pass this on.
I'm glad this has helped with your problem. This is actually one of the things On1 says in their canned response when requesting Tech support. They say to use the uninstaller, run a registry cleaner and reinstall Photo raw. Your results prove this is a valid step to take when troubleshooting problems. I need to add this to my list of tips to try for dealing with a slow PC.
Please let us know if the presets make any difference.0
Sure Rick, right now I'm catching up on work that was in limbo while these issues were being investigated. I'd uninstalled before but didn't use the app that ON1 developed. I think I just removed things manually, and I know better lol0
I sometimes retry uninstalling, reinstall but it never changes my brush lag.
The most improvement happened after switching from a platter drive to a SSD.0
Another thing you can do to increase performance is get an SSD dedicated solely to ON1 cache. Put it on the fastest port you have with a matching enclosure for best speed.0
I'm wsorry, could you explain me the procedure ?
Because, I install ON1 on my New Imac (27", Core I9, SDD, OS X Mojave) but I have not increase the performance comprared to the previous versione of my Imac (Imac 2012, Core I7, SDD on thunderbolt port and OSX High Sierra).
Thank you in advance.0
Did you get an iMac or an iMac Pro? Only the iMac Pro has an internal SSD. The iMac has a Fusion drive which is a spinning platter drive for storage combined with a small SSD for caching most recently used files. Most of the cache will be used by the OS and any active programs so there won't be much left for user data access to be sped up.
Either way you will get an improvement in ON1 performance if you purchase an external SSD in either a Thunderbolt 2 (preferred) or USB 3 enclosure. Connect it directly to one of the ports on your iMac, not through a hub or any shared connection. You want it to have a dedicated connection so nothing but ON1 will try to use it. Next, go to ON1's Preferences > System tab and click the Move… button in the Scratch Folder Location then select your new drive. (I named my external scratch drive Scratch as shown below.)
I also moved my Browse Cache there mostly to save space on my laptop's very small internal SSD. The cache and scratch space won't be accessed by ON1 at the same time so there won't be any access contention issues sharing there.
Also, again mostly due to the size of my internal SSD, I have my photos stored on an external fusion drive.0
I confirm that my new Imac has a 500GB of SSD unit not fusion (on Apple store you can choose during the ordering).
I have partitioned the SSD in two unit, one is for the OSX and the other one is to store the photo during the editing and I reserved the area for the Scratch and the cache.
I'll give you some information about the improving performance in a few days.
Thank you for your answer.0
Seems a lot to go through to adjust to bad software coding and memory management. I use PS/LR/Topaz/ and others and never have lags or this kind of incredible slowness and sporadic results. I hope this next release has addressed all these issues.0
Bill I think you are right and I agree with you, but I'm an elecronic designer and I khow what it means to design and develop a software...
ON1 is a very complex software.... developped on two platform (Windows and OSX...
like you, I hope the team solve this problems in the next release.
It's not easy for the engineers.0
I was in the software industry myself for 40 years before retiring. I've worked with companies that wrote software for satellite positioning and broadcast industry and totally get complex software. This not that complex, it's more of design and Q/A. Some of this that I run into a can't believe it shows up in a release. Anyway, it's a waiting game at this point.0
Since the .5 update for May has been announce, perhaps the "performance improvements" will amount to something.0
Luca, great news on the internal SSD. Partitioning it for your pictures storage is a good idea. However, you still have access contention issues between the OS, ON1 program, image data, & caching I/O operations since they are all on the same drive. The cache drive should be a standalone drive reserved for this use and on its own I/O channel. This is even recommended for Adobe's programs.
Let us know if you see any improvements with your new configuration.0
Bill, I fully agree .... I know the systems you refer to but I think hw is more defined than MAC and PC.
Different microprocessors, graphics cards, and so on ... and above all less pressure from marketing to sell ... 😅😅😅.
Let's wait ... because the functions are excellent ... less (at the moment) the way of ON1 run.0
I know that is not the better way but unfortunately I haven't a second SSD in this moment.
This is the first step to see if there is some improvement.
Thanks a lot for your support.0
Luca, I know! There are some really special options in ON1 that I WANT to use, and that's why I'm hangin' in there.0
I get the feeling that ON1 is yet another Windows program being emulated on the Mac, or at best the Mac as a second class citizen.
My hardware is fast, and MacOS with well written software is faster than Windows, or even Linux most of the time.
On1 is almost unusable, which is a shame.
Does anyone know if ON1 is a native Mac application, or is it running on/with a Windows transition layer of some kind?0
Yes, ON1 Photo RAW is a Mac native application written for the Mac.0
After around 10 days, that I'm using a new Imac with core I9, SSD and after migration of Scratch and cache in an external SDD (USB3,1 Gen 2), the ON1 is little bit more faster but not so much respect the improvement of hardware.
I'm sorry but I'm not so happy...
I'm wainting 2 weeks for testing a new release 2019.5....0
I've pretty much taken ON1 out of my workflow, it's not worth the frustration and Roulette results, never know what I'm going to get. Especially using the "AI" masking and the term is incorrectly used. I have more consistent results using PS select and mask. I sure hope they fix these things with the next release, if not the next version should be free. There are many fine pieces in the ON1 app, but they seemed to be loosely pulled together.0
I believe that with the newsletter they sent about ON1 2019.5, I hope they have extensively tested the software..
I'm confident.... :-)0
Anybody seen the "Shortly available" Beta version of 2019.5?0
No, I asked Whitney yesterday. It's not ready yet.
They will announce it in the Plus forums when it is, if you're not a Plus member, you won't have access to it.0
Thanks for the quick reply and info Rick. I am anxious to see if the speed improvements work for me. I feel like I am just about maxed out as far as speed and latency goes. I have an older I7, 16 gig ram, Nvidia GT710. I don't have any ssd drives because all my ports are usb 2.0.
I can apply 4-6 filters and do some masking and a few local adjustments without a lot of lag. I work on 20 bb NEF raw files.
I don't think this machine could handle some of the newer files with many adjustments so I am interested to see if there is any noticeable differences in 2019.5
I can't really complain about how it is working now. I have done most of the tweeking that I've read about on here. I do love the workflow in ON1 and it is fun playing around with layers.0
The newsletters just speak to all these new features coming out, but I wish they spent more time on the core functions rather than adding more weight to the system. I have an old dell (for backups/emergencies) that's has 16gb of ram, it's about 10 years old, one of their XPS series where PS and LR run flawlessly on it, very slow yes, but it works without a hitch. I've used their products since Ver. 8 and don't want to lose it, just hard staying on board during their growing pains. :)
I keep getting emails to join their "plus" group, really? I'd love to join if I could depend on the app.0
The newsletter also says: "Performance Improvements — Zooming, panning, and brushing are now much faster. A new preview quality option can help increase performance on lower-end and integrated video cards as well. Export is now up to 10x faster when resizing or exporting a photo or photos already edited."
I hope in a ridesign or optimization of the software source code .... not easy to do, but very important for the future of ON1...
I agree with you about ON1 Plus group...
Have a nice day....0
I really hope they have a successful launch with this version., My frustration is like having a great truck that runs great and you use it to take material to the job, one day you decide to update the truck, with new features and performance. As you start using it, it constantly stalls, hasn't the power before because of the new engine design, and sometimes you are left stranded in the middle of the road. :)0
.5 did not improve the brush lag on my iMac.0
For me a few tests it takes an unreasonable amount of time to bring up a folder thumbnails. I have the preview set to fast and the thumbnails small. I rebooted the system first, shut down any programs running and just let ON1 .5 bring up a folder. This folder has a lot of raw files and is quite large, so I changed folders after waiting a full 5 minutes and it still hadn't loaded completely.
So I went to another folder where I keep my images for display online, and this folder is all .jpgs and relatively small files averaging 1500x1500 pixels and 1-3 mbs This took about 3 minutes to load. Now it seems it has to re-write/re-display the thumbnails as you scroll, where LR does not. The good news is most of this can be attributed to the first time for this version to read the folders, when I went back to the complete read of the smaller folder, they popped up fast. However, I keep getting a "RAM+Swap" almost full message from Clean My Mac software. This message has never shown up on any other program.
After quitting On1 and re launced, went back into the folders, the smaller one came up immediately, the larger folder was faster but slower to LR and I tried a new free Raw processor called Darktable and it had no problem reading the folders.
The "AI" masking seems faster and more accurate. I only did one test, but will work on some other things like replacing backgrounds and see how it does. The system so far, in general, seems more pulled together and consistent but this is only my first time using it. I will attend today's webinar just to see if I've missed any settings.
I REALLY want this software work as it should. There are so many little features that are cool and you can tell there was a lot of work put into this dot release. We can just keep banging on it and see how it does. :)0
I watched it max out my system's 16GB of RAM while it was rebuilding the catalogs and generating new previews. Once that had finished my memory usage went back to normal.0
Well while testing masking replacing background:
the Refine brush, simply cleaning up an edge actually locked up the computer for about 20 seconds, the mouse wouldn't move, keyboard, everything was no responsive.
The masking brush is still lagging behind and the image seems to be constantly focusing and refocusing and adjusting, not good.
No other program I use has this kind of brush lag, even the free ones. sigh.1
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