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Sluggish performance on Windows 11

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41 comments

  • Brian Lawson Community moderator

    Go with what works for you Justin. :)

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  • Carl Traub

    My system is running an 8 core/16 thread CPU with 32G RAM at 3200Mhz, with an integrated GPU.  It’s AMD’s latest and most powerful integrated CPU/GPU combo, 5700G.  I run with a single 4K monitor, on Windows 10. OS and video drivers are always up to date.

    When both Browsing and Editing, I never have the Preset Column or Filmstrip displayed, knowing that this could impact performance. I don't use a catalog because they brought my system to a crawl, even while showing minimal activity in the Resource Monitor (5 to 10 seconds just to show mouse movement on the display).

    The histogram corruption that I refer to is spelled out in detail in several emails to support, but I know that the online community does not have access to that information. When I am editing an image in PR 2022.1, I experience an odd corruption within the Levels histogram display.  It is not a consistent problem, but other users have reported similar sporadic problems.  Moving any slider even just a small amount can change what was a valid histogram display into one that shows either a single bar all the way to the right, just the right half of the histogram, or some other weird graph.  During a 30 second video sent to support, there were about a dozen different slider positions that produced corrupt/invalid graphs.  During this time, the image always displayed properly, and there were always white values in the image, so there should be data all the way to the left.

    Below is a screenshot of a valid Levels histogram display from an image.  The graph shows that pixels exist from black to white.

    Below are several screenshots showing an invalid histogram for the same image.  The only change was to move the Opacity slider, although it's not only the Opacity slider that causes this problem.  Again, the main image shows no corruption, it's only the graph that gets messed up.

     

     

     

    To be clear, I never expected my integrated GPU to perform as well as a standalone GPU. As a very computer literate user, I am aware that there are limitations with an integrated GPU.  I just didn’t expect an integrated GPU to be blamed for video corruption and program crashes, and to be brushed aside as unsupported hardware. Nor that the hardware would perform so much slower with PR than other software.  If they flat out don’t want to support integrated GPUs, that should be explicitly stated, and the installer shouldn’t install the app.  Whether with the GPU performance slider in PR turned way up or way down, the performance is rather poor and unstable.

    I also know that testing all hardware scenarios is unrealistic.  But I’ve also seen that a disproportionate number of performance complaints seem to come from systems with AMD CPUs, regardless of GPU configuration. But Justin is indicating poor performance with a recent Intel CPU and dedicated GPU.   I’ve run 4K video processing on my previous 2 generations of hardware which have all had AMD CPUs with integrated GPUs, and was pleased with the performance.  Despite major hardware upgrades, PR still shows sub-par performance.

    I’ve entertained the idea of adding a standalone GPU. But I don’t really have the confidence, nor has ON1 shown any confidence, that it will improve my situation.  And I think Justin's experience shows that a dedicated GPU still won't guarantee acceptable performance.  With such a wide range of user experiences even across higher end GPUs, it's hard to have any confidence that lack of a GPU really is the cause of my performance and corruption issues.  Even with a dedicated GPU, Justin can't get acceptable support feedback.

    It's clear that a number of users are happy with the performance of PR.  But it's also clear that a number aren't.  Support asks the same basic questions of us, and nothing happens to improve the situation.  I know as moderators you do your best to help other users, and I really do appreciate the time you put into it to responding to questions and concerns.  But these performance situations clearly need more work from the engineering side, and On1 hasn't really shown any concern for addressing them.

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  • Brian Lawson Community moderator

    I wonder if the problem for the AMD systems comes from the Microsoft Visual Studio IDE I'm pretty sure they use since it can produce both Mac and Windows code. If it is optimized for Intel processors could that affect the AMD systems?

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  • Justin Martin

    Interesting. I'd always assumed it was Java, never considered .NET core was an option for them.

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  • Brian Lawson Community moderator

    Java has its own UI and file system interface that is the same on both Mac and Windows systems and I hate it. It is extremely clunky and does not have any of the shortcuts the OS provides. It does look exactly alike on both OSes though so I guess there's something for consistency.

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  • Oddvar Næss

    Just a follow-up from my previous comment. I have now tested the PR2022.5 for about 24hrs. First I just upgraded the previous version on my existing system and verified Nvidia GPU was selected. I could not find any significant change in performance. I really wanted this to work this time so I decided to go through all the trouble it involves and formatted my computer. Did a clean install of Win11 and all my programs, made sure all drivers was the latest and installed PR2022.5. To my disappointment I cannot detect any significant increase in performance. I realized I probably could have tried to just run PR2022.5 on a clean Win11 without my other programs, but then again it would have to be able to co-exist with my normal setup at some point anyway.

    I'm also wondering right now if the issue could be with the fact that my computer is AMD based as well? As I don't have an Intel computer to compare with its hard to tell, but the On1 team should be able to tell for sure.

    The good news is that highlight recover seems significantly improved, almost as good as LR and fully acceptable for me. Also my Panasonic RW2 raw files are now supported and does not cause me trouble anymore. 

    My conclusion is that the upgrade had some good improvements, just not on the performance side of things. I will probably use it alongside LR for certain edits. I really like it and I think it is the most complete raw editor out there right now. However, as it doesn't improve my workflow or save me any time it seems I will have to stick with LR6 as the main tool for some time still. Hope for further updates to fix my issues...

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  • Carl Traub

    Regarding the compiler optimization question, that certainly is a possibility.  MS's compiler has separate switches for Intel, AMD, and 'both', as well as several other platforms.  If they are targeting Intel only, that could certainly leave AMD with subpar performance. 

    I'm not sure that I could get On1 to provide me any information on their compiler settings based on my previous interactions with them.

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  • David Kick

    I know AMD integrated GPUs are pretty good BUT pushing a 4K monitor while running On1 is going to be a stretch for any integrated GPU.

    And a reminder for anyone running Windows 11.  Be sure to go into the Graphis settings and set On1 to high power. If you don't Windows may decide to set it to Power Saving which could be a problem. The Windows 11 "Power Saving" overrides anything that you may have setup in the drivers for your graphics cards.

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  • Holger Danielsson

    Please note that ON1 Photo RAW uses the Qt framework, which is designed to produce code for Windows, Mac and even Linux systems with relatively few changes in the source code. Qt announces their framework with:

    "One framework. One codebase. Any platform."

    So there are no special compiler settings for Intel or AMD. I know this, because I have also written programs using this framework.

     

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  • Carl Traub

    The QT framework can be configured to use other compilers, including Visual Studio.  So knowing that QT is being used doesn't tell us which compiler they are using.

    If they are using the QT compiler, it could still have flags to optimize for given instruction sets or platforms.  Visual Studio also supports other platforms, including ARM and mobile environments.

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  • Holger Danielsson

    Yes, you are right. 

    But this means that the graphics settings, which are shown above by David, are really important and all that users can do (beside a good graphics card, SSD and so on). Brian and Rick have mentioned this very often too.

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